Views of Argumentativeness and TBI

[Queenie Alexander]

I am keen to hear from survivors and carers on their experiences and explanations regarding frequency, depth, duration, causes of arguments post TBI.

There are some views that TBI sufferers can tend to be 'more argumentative' as a kind of personality function in some cases.  It seems, though, that a lot of arguments must still be based on vulnerability, due to impaired self esteem.  So you get a sort of huge reaction to something rather small.  Also that slow processing, problems with attention and memory might simply cause misunderstandings.  Some situations I can think of are:

- where the TBI sufferer feels they are defending themselves because they have misunderstood a comment as a criticism
- where they feel they have to explain themselves over (and over) again because they have missed the initial response of the carer, who doesn't realise that.  So the carer might have said, early in the argument, "I'm sorry, I misunderstood," but that got missed, so the person with TBI seems to be too uncompromising.

[Hope]

i am more stuck in how i am now even when i am wrong sometimes and know it i want to be right I am working on that

[Richard J]

That's quite a question you're asking. I've been told that I always seemed to be "mad as hell" for the first couple of months and even after 7 years I can still seem angry when talking to my family or friends or co-workers. I have what is called aphasia, meaning I miss words or use the wrong words when talking and have to explain it again. I also think it happens when I'm hearing the people I talking with. What they said make senses to them, but not to me and I have to ask them to repeat what they just said. Which can seem like I'm mad. Having to explain or asking others to explain drives me crazy but I know it's my aphasia acting up. I hate being in loud rooms or next to a TV/stereo/radio when I talking to others, because it's really hard (if not impossible) for me to filter out the other noises. And if there are many people in the conversation talking at the same time, I know I miss a lot of things what were said. So now, I listen very carefully (almost reading their lips), and I talk slower. People who knew me before and know that I had a traumatic brain injury, either let's my "anger" pass or they think "here he goes again and gives me a ugly look" which tells me to breath and try again.

So frequency? it seems to come and go. But less and less as the days go by. Depth? No depth at all really. Duration? I really hope "not forever".

[Queenie Alexander]

You seem to have learned a lot about yourself, Richard, and it is useful for me to read what you write. Thanks. I can identify with the problems with noise in the background, although I don't have TBI; I am far too attentive to noise to be able to screen it out whilst I am doing something else. Which reminds me - my partner has a problem with sound now. I will make that another topic.

best,

Queenie

Richard J said:

That's quite a question you're asking. I've been told that I always seemed to be "mad as hell" for the first couple of months and even after 7 years I can still seem angry when talking to my family or friends or co-workers. I have what is called aphasia, meaning I miss words or use the wrong words when talking and have to explain it again. I also think it happens when I'm hearing the people I talking with. What they said make senses to them, but not to me and I have to ask them to repeat what they just said. Which can seem like I'm mad. Having to explain or asking others to explain drives me crazy but I know it's my aphasia acting up. I hate being in loud rooms or next to a TV/stereo/radio when I talking to others, because it's really hard (if not impossible) for me to filter out the other noises. And if there are many people in the conversation talking at the same time, I know I miss a lot of things what were said. So now, I listen very carefully (almost reading their lips), and I talk slower. People who knew me before and know that I had a traumatic brain injury, either let's my "anger" pass or they think "here he goes again and gives me a ugly look" which tells me to breath and try again.

So frequency? it seems to come and go. But less and less as the days go by. Depth? No depth at all really. Duration? I really hope "not forever".

[Queenie Alexander]

Such humility. Thanks. Actually I also have the same problem - and I am not the TBI person. I have been working on it for some time and I can see now that the matter is urgent.

best,

Queenie

Hope said:

i am more stuck in how i am now even when i am wrong sometimes and know it i want to be right I am working on that

[Ricky Myers]

if people would give us enough time to process the info we would be more cooperative

[Greg Hall]

I had the nursing staff chart me as being opposititional because I was diabetic and they were trying to give me far too much fast acting insulin. I took the long term (Lantus) insulin, but declined the fast acting insulin, telling them I did not know where to find enough fruit juice to bring my sugar level back up if I took the fast acting insulin. They didn't check my medical records to find that I was a Master level social worker with MHMR at the time. I am now disabled due to TBI related issues. I still get doctors checking my feet for diabetic nueropathy, and I explain that I feel my feet just fine - it is how the brain handles the signal that is my problem. I stay away from noise and wear sound deadening headphones that construction workers use in order to reduce sound input. I usually watch tv with the words on the screen instead of using the volume.

[Queenie Alexander]

I have a question about your interesting comments. Could you tell me why you "stay away from noise and wear sound deadening headphones that construction workers use in order to reduce sound input"? What is it about the sounds that causes you distress?

Also, is it easier for you to keep up with written material rather than sounds?

(You wrote: "I usually watch tv with the words on the screen instead of using the volume."

Thanks
Queenie

Greg Hall said:

I had the nursing staff chart me as being opposititional because I was diabetic and they were trying to give me far too much fast acting insulin. I took the long term (Lantus) insulin, but declined the fast acting insulin, telling them I did not know where to find enough fruit juice to bring my sugar level back up if I took the fast acting insulin. They didn't check my medical records to find that I was a Master level social worker with MHMR at the time. I am now disabled due to TBI related issues. I still get doctors checking my feet for diabetic nueropathy, and I explain that I feel my feet just fine - it is how the brain handles the signal that is my problem. I stay away from noise and wear sound deadening headphones that construction workers use in order to reduce sound input. I usually watch tv with the words on the screen instead of using the volume.

[Queenie Alexander]

Queenie Alexander said:

I have a question about your interesting comments. Could you tell me why you "stay away from noise and wear sound deadening headphones that construction workers use in order to reduce sound input"? What is it about the sounds that causes you distress?

Also, is it easier for you to keep up with written material rather than sounds?

(You wrote: "I usually watch tv with the words on the screen instead of using the volume."

Thanks
Queenie

Greg Hall said:

I had the nursing staff chart me as being opposititional because I was diabetic and they were trying to give me far too much fast acting insulin. I took the long term (Lantus) insulin, but declined the fast acting insulin, telling them I did not know where to find enough fruit juice to bring my sugar level back up if I took the fast acting insulin. They didn't check my medical records to find that I was a Master level social worker with MHMR at the time. I am now disabled due to TBI related issues. I still get doctors checking my feet for diabetic nueropathy, and I explain that I feel my feet just fine - it is how the brain handles the signal that is my problem. I stay away from noise and wear sound deadening headphones that construction workers use in order to reduce sound input. I usually watch tv with the words on the screen instead of using the volume.

[Queenie Alexander]

I will try to remember that. I have noticed this with my partner.
Thanks.
Queenie.

Ricky Myers said:

if people would give us enough time to process the info we would be more cooperative

[Donna McNeil]

we get lost in the confusion and lash out till we can get handle on things, which for some is a lifetime, we can become quit difficult and hard headed

[Emerson]

Queenie, there is also a healing/learning curve that takes a long time regarding impulse control. This is in addition to and also related to the processing speed issue.

In the normal, non-TBI brain/pre-TBI brain, we all have combative reactions to things but we squelch the impulse so fast that often we are even unaware that we do it; the squelching is so fast. I think we especially do it unconsciously with the people we love. The non-injured, healthy brain is able to rapidly process the information that "Hey! I love this woman and I don't want to fight." as well as, and possibly even faster than the irritation. The brain is able to rapidly come up with soothing thoughts and rationalizations to explain away and diffuse what caused the momentary flash or irritation or anger. You probably are doing it a lot right now in regards to your partner.

Your partner simply cannot do that right now. What ever the very first impulse is comes roaring out. I am a few years post injury and am finally at the point that I can cancel out an impulse/thought/feeling; to be able to have it and hold it up to the light and compare it to reality. That is a lot of processing that has to happen to be able to do that. My doc has told me that processing speed is the slowest thing to come back.

Additionally we are more emotional! I wrote a blog post entitled I Cry At Commercials on my external blog. Just as the tears are closer to the surface, so is the frustration and the irritation.

One thing that might help is at some calm point discuss with your partner ways that you jointly can handle the situation. The thing I would recommend the most is to have some kind of agreement that when the anger flares you both acknowledge that this is what is happening, and when possible, back off the situation for a bit of time and that he takes time to Think and Feel through it. He needs to give himself the time for his brain to process the information.

One other thing worth mentioning is that increased irritation can also occur if a person is on too much stimulant medication. You can ask the pharmacist about that as well as the doctor.

HTH